Welcome to today's thread - 2025 #CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Day 01 - Ravières - Montbard - Paris - Stuttgart - Nürnberg - Marktredwitz
Today's re-visited borders:
Kehl 🇩🇪 - Krimmeri-Meinau 🇫🇷
(how long will Dobrindt’s ridiculous controls delay my train?)
Borders map, inc. borders re-visited:
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-all-the-borders_935041#15/48.5754/7.8041
To Paris for a meeting with Kai Tegethoff MEP first – before Kai tries to head to Portugal by train. My trip then takes me east (and likely delayed by border controls at Kehl) onwards to Marktredwitz on the border to Czechia. No new borders today though.
New for this tour: I’ve found a new way of linking to active map layers. So maps for the day should be easier to read.
Here’s today’s intro video: https://peertube.netzbegruenung.de/w/mYHgR9gdBBcdpPaVHrqpJi
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 1 of 74
TER 91371
06:39 Nuits-sous-Ravières - Montbard 06:48
SNCF for TER Mobigo
Train type: Bombardier AGC bi-mode MU, 2x 4 short carriages
⚡️ (1.5kV dc)
🚲: ✅
🦽: ✅ (step free if station allows, Nuits doesn’t, Montbard does)
🛜: ⛔️
🍽️: ⛔️
🧳: 🙂
🧽: 😐 (grimy roof inside, loo makes whole carriage stink. But it’s orderly)
🎫 Interrail: 🙂 (accepted)
TER 91371
06:39 Nuits-sous-Ravières - Montbard 06:48
Distance: 18.2km
Average speed: 121km/h
1 stops:
Montbard
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#13/47.6738/4.2743
App tip this morning
SNCF‘s main app - SNCF Connect - is generally terrible. Use @12train to book instead
And when travelling use Ma Gare SNCF - it gives useful information like where your carriage will stop before screens in French stations do
@jon Can you flip Scroll wheel zoom to true when you make future links? It looks like having it on false disables panning around the map with a single finger on mobile (but, ironically, not the "pinch" zooming gesture, which does also indirectly let you pan around the map)
@jon @notjustbikes is searching for a transit researcher. Is this interesting for you? https://standardbroadcast.notion.site/25cf3f9536a480e8b82cfbc425e78f5b
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 2 of 74
TGV 6760
07:05 Montbard - Paris Gare de Lyon 08:09
SNCF Voyageurs
Train type: Alstom TGV Duplex, 8 short double deck carriages
⚡️ (1.5kV dc, 25kV ac, 1.5kV dc)
🚲: ⛔️
🦽: ✅ (step free into lower level, lift down inside)
🛜: ✅ (and it's just about working)
🍽️: ✅
🧳: ☹️ (Duplex, so terrible. Thankfully it's mostly business travellers today)
🧽: 😐 (Rare for a TGV not cleaned properly inside)
🎫 Interrail: 😐 (needs compulsory reservation, costs €10 or €20)
TGV 6760
07:05 Montbard - Paris Gare de Lyon 08:09
Distance: 215.5km
Average speed: 202km/h
1 stops:
Paris Gare de Lyon
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#9/48.2351/3.3555
Rolling into Paris on time. I might dislike some aspects of how SNCF operates, but this Montbard - Paris TGV has solid reliability in general. #CrossBorderRail
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour 1 of 17
Paris Gare de Lyon - Brasserie à la place Saint-Georges
Distance: 6km
Est. duration: 0:30
This bike route, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#14/48.8614/2.3562
Fixing the Birdy is never done 😀
Hit a bump crossing Paris and the front reflector breaks off
(There are other reflectors on the bike so I’m still road safe)
@jon came through there a couple of weeks ago. Took ten minutes so we just managed to run for our connection. I didn't see them actually look at a single passport
@jon
That morning train is basically always business travellers, especially on not-Friday. Lots of laptops and tablets instead of bags and dogs.
@speculationfictive I spent two hours seeing what they were doing there in mid August. It makes no sense. But it’s faster than it used to be.
Back in the city. And it’s a breezy autumn day. Perfect light.
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour 2 of 17
Brasserie à la place Saint-Georges - 23 Bvld Madeleine - Café les Deux Gares (Gare de l’est)
Distance: 2km
Est. duration: 0:45
This bike route, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#16/48.8738/2.3417
@jon have i extolled the virtues of the RFI's equivalent for Italy? https://iechub.rfi.it/ArriviPartenze/en/ArrivalsDepartures/Home
extremely retro but it's the only one I have found that lists all departures and platforms.
SNCF: let’s speed you to Strasbourg in less than 2 hours
Also SNCF: let’s design platform barriers so badly it takes everyone ages to get onto the platform 👏
Oh and send a rubbish truck through!
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 3 of 74
TGV 9575
13:54 Paris Est - Stuttgart Hbf 17:04
SNCF Voyageurs, DB Fernverkehr
Train type: Alstom TGV Euroduplex, 8 short double deck carriages (8 more to Colmar)
⚡️ (25kV ac, 15kV ac)
🚲: ⛔️
🦽: ✅ (but platform 27 isn’t step free - I assume there’s a lift)
🛜: ⛔️ (doesn’t work)
🍽️: ⛔️ (bistro closed today)
🧳: ☹️ (Duplex. Awful. Thankfully it’s empty)
🧽: 🙂
🎫 Interrail: 😐 (needs compulsory reservation, costs €19)
TGV 9575
13:54 Paris Est - Stuttgart Hbf 17:04
Distance: 607.9km
Average speed: 192km/h
3 stops:
Strasbourg
Karlsruhe Hbf
Stuttgart Hbf
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#8/48.894/5.778
@jon interesting that the average speed isn't so much bigger than the first train in your day ;-)
The passenger across the aisle from me here:
- travelling on Interrail (as per questions from the train manager)
- is charging their phone with a UK-EU plug adapter
- has a bottle of wine, a can of beer, and an electric toothbrush poking out of an opulent leather handbag
- has red nails so long typing is hard
- is at least 70 years old
@julienmarchal Are you coming on the special train Sunday Karlsruhe to Wintersdorf? @tops
@julienmarchal https://tag-der-schiene.de/event/mit-volldampf-fuer-eine-grenzueberschreitende-schiene-dampfzugfahrt-nach-wintersdorf/ Details here. And @tops I assume you're not still in/near Karlsruhe on Sunday?
@jon I meet screencap this and post it in the Facebook group for older interrailers and see if someone there turns out to have been sitting across from you
Departing Strasbourg
I know a stop for illegal passport controls at Kehl is ahead
There's one obvious ethnic minority passenger in my carriage. The train is about 1/3 full. Let's see what happens...
@jon Maybe it's time for a little practical joke? Talk to that person, and a few other fellow passengers. Gather around him/her, and when the Bundespolizei approaches, you all offer your documents, without asking. See if the police ignores you others and just checks the "obvious" one.
(Assuming you can find enough like-minded co-passengers.)
@jon the faster the method of transport the crappier and slow the boarding experience is... i see a trend line here
Yeah. Who did they control?
The ethnic minority person.
Fuckers, really.
I approached the police and asked why they only control ethnic minorities.
“She was the only one not to show her passport without asking” he said.
It makes me so effing totally fucking furious.
Every single time.
Racism pure and simple.
@jon i don't get why they don't check a couple of white people and make it look slightly less obvious that they are racist. But nope. They don't even hide it.
And they hauled a black guy off and were going through his papers on the platform.
I could have been transporting *anything* and got through no problem.
@jon Clearly everyone knows that all Russian saboteurs are black... boggle
These checks are
- racist
- arbitrary (as they check trains more than other modes at Kehl)
- costly (labour intensive)
- inefficient (why not check while a train is moving?)
- ineffective (the pedestrian bridge at Kehl isn’t checked)
- annoying (they delay everyone)
Could you imagine anything more abjectly shit?
@quixoticgeek @jon Partially because they know there will be no consequences and partially because they assume all the other white people agree with them (because to them it's so normal and obvious) + doing it this way makes everyone else around a little bit complicit.
@redjives @quixoticgeek how quickly the officer made up something in response to me asking him about picking on the minority was interesting. It wasn’t the first time he had been asked.
@jon I don't show my passport without asking, other than when I'm queuing at a passport booth in a port (the clue's in the name, eh? "pass" "port").[#]
Otherwise you're just acquiescing in advance to a police state.
[#] I have occasionally had to show my passport for domestic travel. Within Burma that was sort of expected ... but having to do so within ***FRANCE*** wasn't.
@TimWardCam passengers were warned with an announcement to have ID to hand.
@jon Arresting people for not taking their passport with them to the beach. (France.) And delaying us for so long that there wasn't enough of the day left to get to the beach, so the kids didn't get their beach visit that holiday.
@TimWardCam French ID law doesn’t oblige you to have a passport with you anyway. There are 20 or so acceptable IDs. But “l’etranger doit prouver son nationalité”. Which gives police enough room to discriminate if they want to.
@redjives @quixoticgeek @jon And partially they know that some of those white persons, including me, would file a complaint because of the illegal control.
@nyca @redjives @quixoticgeek Schengen is suspended here. So I can’t file about this one. I have the numbers of the police vests though so could complain they behaved in a discriminatory manner.
@jon OK, fair enough, provided the warning was repeated in a reasonable set of languages.
@jon
I'm good with all of that except the long red nails. As a working chef I could never have long or painted nails. It's a staus that I have continued to this day. And... er... I might be a little older than she is.
@jon yes, on to Lille tomorrow and back to London on Thursday. Back down through France mid-October and up again to the UK mid-November. @julienmarchal
@patrick I probably made an error somewhere 😀 (But I’m delayed so maybe it was fate. Will check)
@jon
"Could you imagine anything more abjectly shit?"
Yes - left SNCF run it 😂
@jon But hey, you can ride a nice Bundesbahn vintage-style "n-Wagen" when you pick the right RE for this connection 😂
@SonstHarmlos As Stuttgart Hbf is a hellish building site I’m going to go to Schwäbisch Hall and hopefully get food there. And then take the next RE to Nürnberg from there.
And if any of my followers could tell me which of these stations would give me the best chance of passable food (and ideally a beer) near the station I’d be grateful!
Edit: Rail logic wins over food logic. I’ll go to Schwäbisch Hall Hessental. There’s a pizza place at the station. And I’ll have an hour there.
@jon Bad Cannstatt definitely will have the most options, right inside or around the station. If you have time to burn, you could also take the U-Bahn from Hauptbahnhof to Mineralbäder and go to Flora & Fauna https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/3408848078
@jon Murrhardt seems to have a Rewe on walking distance.
@jon I would have stayed in Stuttgart and walked to Kraftpaule... https://maps.app.goo.gl/HVW2aZZabB6W4mvV8
Delayed on the Murrbahn to Schwäbisch Hall - Hessental due to congestion caused by a stranded train
From next year they want to run ICEs through here
But making this double track throughout - despite it connecting Stuttgart and Nürmberg is considered uneconomic. 🤷♂️
@jon I'm travelling there four or five times a year and literally *each time* there is a different train or a different issue on this route!!!
But the view is great as long as you like rural area.
@jon Rail logic always wins - though Hessental is a depressing place (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/KZ_Hessental). Have a good trip!
@jon I like the Haller Löwenbräu 🥰 (even though I only drink alcohol-free beer)
@jon I still remember one of my first train journeys ever in kindergarten. We all bought some candies in the kiosk at Sulzbach (Murr), sadly the kiosk closed many years ago. For the next time: there is a really good restaurant right next to the station called „zur Eisenbahn“ which I recommend (if you travel during noon and not on a Monday).
This beer respects Jon’s rule of the German Reinheitsgebot. The law is no guarantee of a good beer, but it is a guarantee against a bad one. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinheitsgebot?wprov=sfti1#
@jon the beer is good, but they also make a beer called „Mohrenköpfle“ (highly controversial name, definitely). But that tastes really good.
@jon everytime the long-distance trains are rerouted via the Murrbahn, everything is delayed 😕
Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental
Feels like the sort of place where a Peek+Cloppenburg shirt, with one too many buttons open, and a medallion, is the height of cool
Part of you audience agrees, part doesn't know if they are supposed to feel insulted 😅
And clearly that’s the message the ICE got
What the hell is a Stuttgart - München ICE 611 doing in Schwäbisch Hall - Hessental? 🤔
@jon
Also eigentlich ganz klar:
"...bitte informieren Sie sich im Internet... Täterätäterätätäää"
We have the train equivalent of gridlock here
The diverted ICE can’t move because the delayed regional train ahead of it is blocking it. Nothing can go the other way as it’s a congested single track line towards Backnang
Well done everyone! Party 🎉
@jon It is missing a bald man with round glasses on the label
@jon apparently it got initially redirected from Ulm to Aalen (which would make sense, considering the 10+ "Störung" icons around Stuttgart), but then... something happened, and it was forced to do a second redirect further north; that something is unfortunately not reflected either in DBnav announcements or anything reported on strecken.info
@jon DB needs the equivalent of a giant cat to push the broken equipment off the track.
And maybe double-track any route that gets an entire ICE diverted to it.
Also how much should “DB is gonna cock something up somewhere else” be used as justification for improving a track like this? If you can’t run Stuttgart - Ulm - Augsburg you divert here. You can’t properly divert here as the infrastructure is crap.
@jon Arverio, aren't those the people that ducktaped off the Go-Ahead logo's from the displays in the train?
Ah
We can’t run at full speed “wegen der schlechten Infrastruktur auf der wir fahren müssen“ (because the infra is bad)
Well it’s… honest at least!
@jon Yeah, but they bought Go-Ahead Germany and then weren't capable of removing the Go-Ahead logos from the RIS systems afaik, so they did put tape on the screen to hide the old logos.
@jon @smveerman More like Österreichische Bayernbahn, as the rumors are that ÖBB was primarily interested in the Bavarian lines, and the Bawü ones were just the needed attachment
@smveerman @autinerd Although to be fair the infra is probably *even more fragile* in Bayern?
@jon Today seems to be a bad day for DB. Our first train got cancelled after 15m in Basel SBB because SBB is really sick of DBs shenanigans. Then an hour later it also got cancelled at Basel Bad. One of us took a connection via Hannover but that train stranded in Fulda 🙃. Because the rest of us were with bicycles we went to the Reisezentrum and they gave us a connection where we'd arrive at 0600 in Berlin, lol. Luckily we found another one where we would arrive 2230. Right now the train is only half an hour late but should arrive, hopefully. Fingers crossed that there are no further news on this front today. 😅
(I'd still take the train every time. Fuck flying and fucking tax that shit.)
@jon I have just nerdsniped myself and am trying to identify the heraldry.
@jon Is this illegal shit also happening on the Brussels-Dortmund Thalys and leading to delays there?
@ubx No, not often. I go through Aachen quite a lot and only got checked once. I think that's more a combination of the Thalys trains getting increasingly unreliable, and all of NRW's rail infra being unreliable!
@ubx (for reasons I don't understand Kehl is the most absurd of all with these checks)
@jon “From next year they want to run ICEs through here”
Oh really? Just a replacement for the Karlsruhe-Nuremberg IC or something like Stuttgart-Berlin?
@jon that with the ice is news to me. Where did you get that from?
I frequently use one of IC2 (aka Teppich-RE) that runs from Stuttgart to Nürnberg via Aalen. (The train that was cancelled for you is one of them)
From time to time there are rumours that the IC-service will be cancelled entirely.
Therefore I'm a little bit surprised about the ICEs.
@SonstHarmlos Yes, exactly that. A couple of ICEs to replace some ICs, and promise of Stuttgart-Berlin in c. 5 hours.
@pikka Was announced last week. 2 of the daily ICs are to be replaced by Stuttgart-Berlin ICEs. With no stops between Stuttgart and Nürrnberg.
@jon And the Stuttgart-Berlin ICE will replace the current extension of the Karlsruhe-Nuremberg IC line to Leipzig? (I wouldn’t be surprised, because these ICs are pretty empty north of Nuremberg as far as I experienced)
@jon good to know! Thank you!
Although I'm not sure if that's good news for me, because I usually continue further for Pforzheim. We will see how the connections will be.
Having a proper Bordbistro would definitely be a plus.
@SonstHarmlos Somewhere. But my wifi data is out here in the RE to Nürnberg and I am in the middle of nowhere. So you better search for it, not me.
Stuck in a very German infra dysfunction cycle here
My train - already an hour later than I should have departed - is late. Meaning I’ll be two hours late in Marktredwitz.
But the hotel doesn’t really do email to tell what to do about check in.
But I can’t get through to them because mobile signal is so bad in rural Bayern.
@jon what are the haircut like? Is there a mandatory minimum mullet quota?
@jon just a thought - depending on the urgency of the call - use a German esim with Telekom network? Apps like Aralo could help. But not sure if that will work if you have crap network to begin with
@jon it does fit perfectly to the slogan, doesn't it?
This is I think the strangest DB regional train I’ve ever seen. 4x 2 car DMUs. Each DMU to a different destination, splitting en route! (Bayreuth, Hof, Schwandorf, Weiden) 1 split is normal. But 3?
@jon haha I know that route. Luckily they have those displays (and also those in the trains themselves). I remember a time when it was pure luck to get into the right part of this train.
@jon They’re mixing up megabytes (powers of 10, used for transfer) and mebibytes (powers of 2, used for storage). 150 * 1024 * 1024 = 157 286 400 and you can see the error. It will likely cut you off on a chunk by chunk basis, meaning one big chunk can bring you slightly over limit before blocking.
Not that this makes them less wrong, but if you were curious :)
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@jon Time to add another category:
Boarding time: ☹️ (SNCF. Awful. Thankfully it's empty)
---
Turns out the new category is fully redundant with luggage space 🤭
@jon each part only participates in two splits! First it is split in half, and then both halves go their own way and each of them gets split into quarters later.
IIRC the main split happens in Hersbruck and the subsequent ones, in Pegnitz and/or Neukirchen.
@jon and even more strange is that the passenger information system seems to be able to show this train correctly
@recumbenttravel Yes! The screens are damned good. Both inside the train, and on the platform, and in the audio announcements. It's well done!
The worst thing about DB dysfunction on #CrossBorderRail: it means a whole load of re-mapping and changes to the spreadsheet...
So here we go
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 4 of 75
MEX 90 (17547)
17:55 Stuttgart Hbf - Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental 18:54
DB Regio AG Baden-Württemberg
Train type: Bombardier Talent EMU, 4 short carriages
⚡️ (15kV ac)
🚲: ✅
🦽: ✅ (step free if station allows)
🛜: ⛔️
🍽️: ⛔️
🧳: 🙂
🧽: 🙂
🎫 Interrail: 🙂 (accepted)
MEX 90 (17547)
17:55 Stuttgart Hbf - Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental 18:54
Distance: 73km
Average speed: 74km/h
9 stops:
Stuttgart-Bad Cannstatt
Waiblingen
Winnenden
Backnang
Oppenweiler(Württ)
Sulzbach(Murr)
Murrhardt
Gaildorf West
Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#10/48.9409/9.4745
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 5 of 75
RE 90
20:00 Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental - Nürnberg Hbf 21:45
Arverio Baden-Württemberg
Train type: Stadler EMU, 2x 3 short carriages
⚡️ (15kV ac)
🚲: ✅
🦽: ✅ (step free if station allows, but Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental isn't accessible at all)
🛜: ✅
🍽️: ⛔️
🧳: 🙂
🧽: ☹️ (total mess - grimy outside, dirty inside, broken loos, broken doors - dreadful)
🎫 Interrail: 🙂 (accepted)
(forgot to photograph it, hence stock pic)
RE 90
20:00 Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental - Nürnberg Hbf 21:45
Distance: 117.3km
Average speed: 67km/h
10 stops:
Eckartshausen-Ilshofen
Crailsheim
Schnelldorf
Dombühl
Leutershausen-Wiedersbach
Ansbach
Wicklesgreuth
Heilsbronn
Roßtal
Nürnberg Hbf
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#10/49.2759/10.4075
#CrossBorderRail Conclusions Tour Train 6 of 75
RE 31 (4897)
22:37 Nürnberg Hbf - Marktredwitz 23:58
DB Regio AG Bayern
Train type: Adtranz, Bombardier 612 tilting DMU, 2 carriages (6 carriages to other destinations)
⛽️
🚲: ✅
🦽: ✅ (needs lift on platform, high floor)
🛜: ✅
🍽️: ⛔️
🧳: 😐 (I've seen worse, but not great with big bags)
🧽: 🙂 (Very tidy)
🎫 Interrail: 🙂 (accepted)
RE 31 (4897)
22:37 Nürnberg Hbf - Marktredwitz 23:58
Distance: 124.1km
Average speed: 92km/h
7 stops:
Hersbruck(r Pegnitz)
Neuhaus(Pegnitz)
Pegnitz
Kirchenlaibach
Immenreuth
Neusorg
Marktredwitz
This train, mapped: https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/crossborderrail-2025-conclusions-tour_1266988#10/49.7218/11.5562
And here is today's #CrossBorderRail summary video
https://peertube.netzbegruenung.de/w/6R5a712cQ3E3Vyz823hAv6
Explaining today's annoyances with border controls and train dysfunctions!
@jon
That’s the region I grew up and lived in for ~35 years. Any questions? 🤭
@jon
I took that connection in the opposite direction a few weeks ago but got off at Crailsheim to get another train (RE80 iirc).
Note to fellow travelers: If you try to get a coffee refill into your thermos, brace yourself. The two Franconian counter ladies inside that tiny kiosk that is the station’s infrastructure are not at all enthusiastic about the idea of doing something different from how they did it all the time. Pouring coffee to go not first in paper cups: PHEW!!
@jon Pretty sure I've seen this train on YouTube from the drivers perspective on this channel: https://youtube.com/@regiotf206
@jon
This is Franconia, Bavarian occupied territories … 😏
But seriously: work is being done, one connection at a time. As far as I know, the Bamberg-Würzburg line is currently a single construction site.
The other big problem is, of course, the fossil Bavarian government.
@jon we've got ETCS Level 3 at home
ETCS Level 3 at home:
@jon whoa… triple traction is already a nightmare for developers of onboard train protection units… 🫣
@jon Also, do I read the letters at the display correctly in that it doesn't show the destination of the four parts in their physical order at the platform?
@jon yes - nothing has changed, I went by bus from Barcelona to Denmark in 1983. Among the passengers were a guy from Africa - he was the one targeted at every bordercrossing to have his baggage controlled!
@jon hehe, I regularly took that connection when I went to uni in Bayreuth. Every time a bunch of confused travellers had to switch because they got the wrong part. Fun!
@jon Schwäbisch Hall is a beautiful city located in the Kocher valley. The train station of Schwäbisch Hall-Hessental is in a suburb area, not pleasant at all. If you take a train towards Heilbronn you will go down the valley and reach the station Schwäbisch Hall with a panoramic view of the beautiful medieval old town. Looks a little bit like Tübingen, but smaller.
@jon
They have different limits for upload and download... holy!
@jon This is helpful data and confirms my theory that an important driving factor of the racist controls is that passengers proactively cooperate. For that reason, I NEVER have my passport ready unless I'm specifically asked for it. Don't submit yourself beforehand and do all the work for them.